Foxcraft - Improve Staff Transparency & Rule Enforcement

Sprenkyy

Supporter
Feb 5, 2018
438
69
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Short Summary – Suggestions to Improve Staff Transparency & Enforcement (Skip to read in detail)


  • Consistent Rule Enforcement: Standardize punishments and interpretations so similar situations get similar outcomes across all staff.
  • Clearer, Less Interpretive Rules: Make rules more specific with examples, FAQs, and clarified gray areas to reduce confusion.
  • Transparency With Vanish & Teleporting: Add clearer explanations/logging so players understand why staff visit bases or teleport.
  • Better Communication With Players: Encourage staff to acknowledge concerns respectfully and explain why official channels are required.
  • Stronger Oversight & Accountability: Improve senior staff reviews, audits, and formal ways to report staff behavior.
  • Clear Staff vs Gameplay Boundaries: Define limits between moderation duties and personal gameplay involvement.
  • Public Punishment Tiers: Publish warning-to-ban escalation paths so players know what to expect.
  • Improved Community Feedback Options: Add anonymous feedback and public changelogs for rule/policy updates.
  • Private Message Rule Clarification: Clearly explain which chat rules apply to private messages and why, with examples.
  • Feedback on Suggestions: Ensure players receive responses to suggestions, even if they’re declined.
  • Stronger Enforcement Areas: Add rules and harsher penalties for bypassing ignore, griefing, scamming, and improve Discord moderation consistency.



Suggestions to Improve Staff Transparency & Rule Enforcement

More Consistent Rule Enforcement
Sometimes it feels like different staff members handle the same situations differently (for example with AH sales, chat warnings, and punishments). This can make it feel like enforcement is selective.

Suggestion:
Try to standardize punishments and interpretations more so similar situations get similar outcomes.

How this could be done:

  • Use a shared punishment guide for staff.
  • Have clear examples for common rule breaks.
  • Regular staff discussions to make sure everyone is on the same page.
  • Senior staff reviewing edge cases.

Make Rules Less Interpretive and More Clear
Some rules are pretty open to interpretation, which can cause confusion and inconsistent enforcement.

Suggestion:
Make rules more specific and factual.

How this could be done:

  • Add examples to rules (what is allowed vs not allowed).
  • Clarify common gray areas.
  • Add a public rule clarification/FAQ section.
  • Update rules when the same issues keep coming up.

More Transparency With Vanish & Teleporting
Players sometimes notice staff flying around or teleporting to bases (sometimes while players are AFK), which can feel weird or unexplained.

Suggestion:
Add more transparency around vanish and TP usage.

How this could be done:

  • Leave a short note/message explaining why staff were there.
  • Keep better logs that can be reviewed if needed.
  • Limit vanish visits to clear moderation or performance checks.
  • Make it clear when staff are checking vs just observing.

Better Communication When Players Raise Concerns
When players try to bring up issues, responses can sometimes feel dismissive or shut down quickly, even if that’s not the intention.

Suggestion:
Encourage more clear and respectful communication when redirecting players to report channels.

How this could be done:

  • Acknowledge the concern before redirecting.
  • Explain why official channels are needed.
  • Use more neutral/professional wording.
  • Encourage staff to listen, even if the feedback is critical.

Reduce the Feeling of “Unchecked” Staff Activity
Some players feel like certain staff actions or teams aren’t always being properly reviewed.

Suggestion:
Improve internal oversight and accountability.

How this could be done:

  • Senior staff reviewing moderation actions.
  • Internal audits/log reviews.
  • A formal way to submit feedback about staff behavior.
  • General transparency about moderation consistency.

Clear Boundaries Between Moderation and Gameplay
At times it feels like staff may be too involved in player builds/farms in ways that feel more like gameplay than moderation.

Suggestion:
Make clearer boundaries between staff moderation duties and normal gameplay.

How this could be done:

  • Separate moderation actions from personal gameplay where possible.
  • Internal rules about inspecting or copying player designs.
  • Require clear reasons for inspecting locked/private builds.

Public Punishment Tiers (Warnings → Perm Punishments)
Right now, it’s not always clear what punishment to expect for certain offenses. This can make it feel like a second offense might suddenly result in a very harsh punishment.

Suggestion:
Publicly list punishment tiers so players know what to expect.

How this could be done:

  • List all punishment types (warning, mute, temp mute, temp ban, perm mute, perm ban, etc.).
  • Show typical escalation paths (e.g. warning → temp mute → longer mute → perm mute).
  • Explain what counts as repeated or severe offenses.
  • Note when staff can skip tiers for extreme cases.
  • Keep this updated as policies change.

Better Community Feedback Options
Players want to feel heard and taken seriously when raising concerns.

Suggestion:
Add more structured ways for the community to give feedback.

How this could be done:

  • Anonymous feedback forms.
  • Public changelogs for rule/policy updates.



Extra

Clarification on Chat Rules in Private Messages
There is confusion about why certain chat rules (like excessive caps, chat flood, or inappropriate comments) are enforced in private messages and not just in public chat.

Clarification Request (not a rule change):
Many players understand why things like advertising, hate speech, harassment, or serious abuse should be moderated everywhere, including private messages. However, it would be helpful to clearly explain why things like jokes between friends, caps, or spam are moderated in private messages when they are kept out of public chat and are not bothering anyone.

How this could be improved:

  • Add an explanation in the rules (or somewhere else) for why private messages are moderated.
  • Clearly list which chat rules apply to private messages and why.
  • Give examples of what is considered acceptable in private conversations.
  • Clarify how consent between players (joking between friends) is handled.


Feedback on Suggestions (Even When They Can’t Be Used)
Right now, when players post suggestions, it can sometimes feel like they disappear into silence. Even if a suggestion can’t be implemented, it would be really appreciated to at least get a response.

Suggestion:
Respond to suggestions even if the answer is no.

Why this helps:
  • Lets players know their feedback was seen and considered.
  • Helps the community understand why something isn’t possible.
  • Allows players to rethink and improve their ideas with better context.
  • Encourages more constructive discussion with the rest of the community.
  • Makes it feel like player voices actually matter, instead of being ignored.

    Even a short response like “this isn’t possible because of X” or “we’re not planning this right now” would go a long way in making the community feel heard.


Suggested Punishments / Areas for Stronger Enforcement
These are some punishments and enforcement areas the community would like to see added or made stronger.

Suggestions:

  • Punishment for bypassing ignore (contacting someone who has you ignored via Discord, alt accounts, or other methods).
  • Bigger punishments for griefing and scamming, as these directly harm players and the server economy.
  • Stronger and more consistent Discord rule enforcement, as server Discord behavior has become less classy and more toxic over time.

How this could be done:
  • Add explicit rules against bypassing ignores or harassment via alts.
  • Increase minimum punishments for griefing/scamming.
  • Assign dedicated Discord moderation focus.
  • Align Discord and in-game rules more closely.
  • Publish Discord-specific punishment guidelines.
 
Last edited:
Is there anything about reporting players that didn't report the offender for saying one consentual thing in private messages, or they going to keep it up then?

ex. Said the f-word to my friend like we do in other servers and laugh at it.
I did ask for clarification on why the simple stuff in msg's is also monitored. Since it is out of public chat.
If that answers your question
 
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"hOw DaRe YoU sEnD 1 SuGgEstTiOn In A Dm aNd BotHeR tHeM" brother it isn't bothering if it is just a suggestion, clam down
If staff get's 10 of those so called suggestions in their DM's daily. I doubt they would still check them, Even i wouldn't anymore at that point.
I am just redirecting people to the proper channels so our suggestions are actually usable and can be discussed about by the community
 
I did ask for clarification on why the simple stuff in msg's is also monitored. Since it is out of public chat.
If that answers your question
I understand doxxing keywords though, but they shouldn't be monitoring it 24/7 if it isn't reported. I reported a dude on hypixel for doxxing me and he was banned. So idk why they are treating this situation completely different.
Please keep it civil like I asked, if everyone behaves like usual we won't see changes being made
Sorry my bad, but I have suggested some things in the discord normally before, and yet it has been around... a year. I don't know why staff are ignoring suggestions from other members that are civil.
 
If staff get's 10 of those so called suggestions in their DM's daily. I doubt they would still check them, Even i wouldn't anymore at that point.
I am just redirecting people to the proper channels so our suggestions are actually usable and can be discussed about by the community
I see your point, but it should have been transparent when the server first came up and should've been since.
 
I understand doxxing keywords though, but they shouldn't be monitoring it 24/7 if it isn't reported. I reported a dude on hypixel for doxxing me and he was banned. So idk why they are treating this situation completely different.

Sorry my bad, but I have suggested some things in the discord normally before, and yet it has been around... a year. I don't know why staff are ignoring suggestions from other members that are civil.
Well msg's are being constantly monitored preferable to keep out the actual bad stuff, like doxxing
In my opinion jokes with friends should be allowed since you keep it out of public chat like you said.
Hopefully that latter part will be something that can be changed

The official way is on the forums like I did with this server suggestion, not the discord, Hopefully you will see improvement in your suggestions in the future
Though keep in mind not all suggestions are usable, even though it would be nice to hear that part as well so we can work as a community to improve suggestions so they can be actually usable
 
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Well msg's are being constantly monitored preferable to keep out the actual bad stuff, like doxxing
In my opinion jokes with friends should be allowed since you keep it out of public chat like you said.
Hopefully that latter part will be something that can be changed

The official way is on the forums like I did with this server suggestion, not the discord, Hopefully you will see improvement in your suggestions in the future
Though keep in mind not all suggestions are usable, even though it would be nice to hear that part as well so we can work as a community to improve suggestions so they can be actually usable
Yes I sent the same screenshot I sent here to an admin and sent them their own rules and they still stuck with the mute. It isn't really fair that someone wouldn't unmute me from inside the game because they got their feelings hurt though. After I said what I did wasn't against their rules and the person hasn't reported me, they banned me from the discord server. So yes this has been going on for a year.
 
Yes I sent the same screenshot I sent here to an admin and sent them their own rules and they still stuck with the mute. It isn't really fair that someone wouldn't unmute me from inside the game because they got their feelings hurt though. After I said what I did wasn't against their rules and the person hasn't reported me, they banned me from the discord server. So yes this has been going on for a year.
Well the current rule is also enforced in msg's
I just hope to change that for the future
We can't change what happened in the past

But if things change it would make an appeal easier as well for what happened in the past
 
I think this would help improve the server in many such instances and cases. I also think that if staff breaks a rule they should get punished with a mute or whatever themselves instead of just an "oops" and move on about their day. This would keep staff honest because it would also allow players to report them and allow for a honest staff system. Also Sprenk did mention something about it but if someone asks staff why they were at their base, provide a real honest clean answer instead of "i wasn't".

(edit): This also means Cloak and Laylah have to keep their fellow staff honest, and not let them get away with literal staff abuse in many cases. some of which were caught and taken care of
 
Short Summary – Suggestions to Improve Staff Transparency & Enforcement (Skip to read in detail)


  • Consistent Rule Enforcement: Standardize punishments and interpretations so similar situations get similar outcomes across all staff.
  • Clearer, Less Interpretive Rules: Make rules more specific with examples, FAQs, and clarified gray areas to reduce confusion.
  • Transparency With Vanish & Teleporting: Add clearer explanations/logging so players understand why staff visit bases or teleport.
  • Better Communication With Players: Encourage staff to acknowledge concerns respectfully and explain why official channels are required.
  • Stronger Oversight & Accountability: Improve senior staff reviews, audits, and formal ways to report staff behavior.
  • Clear Staff vs Gameplay Boundaries: Define limits between moderation duties and personal gameplay involvement.
  • Public Punishment Tiers: Publish warning-to-ban escalation paths so players know what to expect.
  • Improved Community Feedback Options: Add anonymous feedback and public changelogs for rule/policy updates.
  • Private Message Rule Clarification: Clearly explain which chat rules apply to private messages and why, with examples.
  • Feedback on Suggestions: Ensure players receive responses to suggestions, even if they’re declined.
  • Stronger Enforcement Areas: Add rules and harsher penalties for bypassing ignore, griefing, scamming, and improve Discord moderation consistency.



Suggestions to Improve Staff Transparency & Rule Enforcement

More Consistent Rule Enforcement
Sometimes it feels like different staff members handle the same situations differently (for example with AH sales, chat warnings, and punishments). This can make it feel like enforcement is selective.

Suggestion:
Try to standardize punishments and interpretations more so similar situations get similar outcomes.

How this could be done:

  • Use a shared punishment guide for staff.
  • Have clear examples for common rule breaks.
  • Regular staff discussions to make sure everyone is on the same page.
  • Senior staff reviewing edge cases.

Make Rules Less Interpretive and More Clear
Some rules are pretty open to interpretation, which can cause confusion and inconsistent enforcement.

Suggestion:
Make rules more specific and factual.

How this could be done:

  • Add examples to rules (what is allowed vs not allowed).
  • Clarify common gray areas.
  • Add a public rule clarification/FAQ section.
  • Update rules when the same issues keep coming up.

More Transparency With Vanish & Teleporting
Players sometimes notice staff flying around or teleporting to bases (sometimes while players are AFK), which can feel weird or unexplained.

Suggestion:
Add more transparency around vanish and TP usage.

How this could be done:

  • Leave a short note/message explaining why staff were there.
  • Keep better logs that can be reviewed if needed.
  • Limit vanish visits to clear moderation or performance checks.
  • Make it clear when staff are checking vs just observing.

Better Communication When Players Raise Concerns
When players try to bring up issues, responses can sometimes feel dismissive or shut down quickly, even if that’s not the intention.

Suggestion:
Encourage more clear and respectful communication when redirecting players to report channels.

How this could be done:

  • Acknowledge the concern before redirecting.
  • Explain why official channels are needed.
  • Use more neutral/professional wording.
  • Encourage staff to listen, even if the feedback is critical.

Reduce the Feeling of “Unchecked” Staff Activity
Some players feel like certain staff actions or teams aren’t always being properly reviewed.

Suggestion:
Improve internal oversight and accountability.

How this could be done:

  • Senior staff reviewing moderation actions.
  • Internal audits/log reviews.
  • A formal way to submit feedback about staff behavior.
  • General transparency about moderation consistency.

Clear Boundaries Between Moderation and Gameplay
At times it feels like staff may be too involved in player builds/farms in ways that feel more like gameplay than moderation.

Suggestion:
Make clearer boundaries between staff moderation duties and normal gameplay.

How this could be done:

  • Separate moderation actions from personal gameplay where possible.
  • Internal rules about inspecting or copying player designs.
  • Require clear reasons for inspecting locked/private builds.

Public Punishment Tiers (Warnings → Perm Punishments)
Right now, it’s not always clear what punishment to expect for certain offenses. This can make it feel like a second offense might suddenly result in a very harsh punishment.

Suggestion:
Publicly list punishment tiers so players know what to expect.

How this could be done:

  • List all punishment types (warning, mute, temp mute, temp ban, perm mute, perm ban, etc.).
  • Show typical escalation paths (e.g. warning → temp mute → longer mute → perm mute).
  • Explain what counts as repeated or severe offenses.
  • Note when staff can skip tiers for extreme cases.
  • Keep this updated as policies change.

Better Community Feedback Options
Players want to feel heard and taken seriously when raising concerns.

Suggestion:
Add more structured ways for the community to give feedback.

How this could be done:

  • Anonymous feedback forms.
  • Public changelogs for rule/policy updates.



Extra

Clarification on Chat Rules in Private Messages
There is confusion about why certain chat rules (like excessive caps, chat flood, or inappropriate comments) are enforced in private messages and not just in public chat.

Clarification Request (not a rule change):
Many players understand why things like advertising, hate speech, harassment, or serious abuse should be moderated everywhere, including private messages. However, it would be helpful to clearly explain why things like jokes between friends, caps, or spam are moderated in private messages when they are kept out of public chat and are not bothering anyone.

How this could be improved:

  • Add an explanation in the rules (or somewhere else) for why private messages are moderated.
  • Clearly list which chat rules apply to private messages and why.
  • Give examples of what is considered acceptable in private conversations.
  • Clarify how consent between players (joking between friends) is handled.


Feedback on Suggestions (Even When They Can’t Be Used)
Right now, when players post suggestions, it can sometimes feel like they disappear into silence. Even if a suggestion can’t be implemented, it would be really appreciated to at least get a response.

Suggestion:
Respond to suggestions even if the answer is no.

Why this helps:
  • Lets players know their feedback was seen and considered.
  • Helps the community understand why something isn’t possible.
  • Allows players to rethink and improve their ideas with better context.
  • Encourages more constructive discussion with the rest of the community.
  • Makes it feel like player voices actually matter, instead of being ignored.

    Even a short response like “this isn’t possible because of X” or “we’re not planning this right now” would go a long way in making the community feel heard.


Suggested Punishments / Areas for Stronger Enforcement
These are some punishments and enforcement areas the community would like to see added or made stronger.

Suggestions:

  • Punishment for bypassing ignore (contacting someone who has you ignored via Discord, alt accounts, or other methods).
  • Bigger punishments for griefing and scamming, as these directly harm players and the server economy.
  • Stronger and more consistent Discord rule enforcement, as server Discord behavior has become less classy and more toxic over time.

How this could be done:
  • Add explicit rules against bypassing ignores or harassment via alts.
  • Increase minimum punishments for griefing/scamming.
  • Assign dedicated Discord moderation focus.
  • Align Discord and in-game rules more closely.
  • Publish Discord-specific punishment guidelines.

There’s a bit too many messages going in different directions so I’ll at least try to clarify the new rules as much as possible in this thread. I recognize this may be difficult to understand given the removal of durations, but the purpose of this change is to improve transparency and consistency, not worsen it.

  • As far as punishments go, most of them have remained the exact same. There are only minor adjustments with classification, expiration, and length for specific categories which were already changed internally. Expirations are NOT the length of punishment you’ll receive and an explanation for how this works is provided at the top of the page. The expiration system has been used by staff for years, this is not a new concept whatsoever, we’ve just made it public info for you guys.

  • The staff team has always followed a different staff guide. Over the span of multiple years the public and staff documents have been maintained separately. Naturally and to no one’s fault, issues will arise when two systems which are meant to function simultaneously have very different layouts and designs. A lot of the backlash staff have received over time has actually stemmed from this exact reason because the community’s understanding of our policies came solely from our rules page, whereas staff’s understanding came from a separate and more complicated system. This new layout, which is now extremely similar between both documents, allows us to refine things so that what you guys see is almost identical to what staff see. Having a complete understanding of our system will actually help with advocating against unfair punishments. The reason everyone feels overlooked is because staff and players functioned on entirely different structures, and sometimes what didn’t make sense to you guys made sense to staff. I understand that durations provided nice insight into staff routines but simply highlighting every punishment has not been an effective way to communicate our expectations to the community, nor provided enough examples about what each violation entails. From a moderation standpoint this also has not been ideal because players have abused it to break rules while bypassing major punishments.
    @Sprenkyy and @NuttyNutsman since you guys are pretty vocal I hope you don’t mind being mentioned but I'd like to explain; Sprenky, your report about staff misconduct is simply because the category wasn't thoroughly explained to the public, and Nutty, all of your conflicts are due to a lack of mutual understanding between staff and players. I promise, it has never had anything to do with staff prejudice.

  • In terms of staff consistency, every new staff member already undergoes a long and intensive training period where they are drilled about staff conduct, required to gather approval for punishments, and repeatedly tested about their knowledge. All aspects of the staff team are also monitored regularly by myself and other senior members, and we have several types of internal logs to help with this. Differing staff opinions haven’t actually been a problem as you’ll notice that staff tend to be on the same page. This isn’t because they’re actively working against the community, but because they have a collective understanding of the rules, and this is achieved by actually learning them and not by calculating punishment durations.

  • We don’t punish for trivial matters in private messages unless they’re reported. I’d like to clarify that the mute discussed on Discord was about inappropriate subjects which have no place in a community with children, and we regulate these topics tightly for everyone’s safety. Not quite sure if the mute mentioned in this thread is about the same situation though.

  • Finally, Sprenky explained that the current display for punishment types makes it seem like punishments go directly from minor punishments to permanent ones. I can see why it’d be interpreted that way and will be working on redesigning it, thank you for the genuine feedback. If anyone else has relevant feedback it’d be much appreciated, or if there are still unanswered questions about this feel free to ask.
 
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Hello. Thanks for your respond, I think we are all thinking the same about this. In some cases context does matter and some dont. I feel like context should matter in all cases or that context does not matter in all cases. That way its more clear for everyone. And also i think there shpuld be a extra page on the staff guide for context
 
Hello. Thanks for your respond, I think we are all thinking the same about this. In some cases context does matter and some dont. I feel like context should matter in all cases or that context does not matter in all cases. That way its more clear for everyone. And also i think there shpuld be a extra page on the staff guide for context
Some offences simply don't carry the same weight. Context is always important, however some slurs simply carry a significant historical weight that their definition has become harmfull on its own.

Besides this, creating a list of "forbidden" words only allows loopholes to be found and exploited. The rules are clear and easy to follow; they even include examples. :)
 
There’s a bit too many messages going in different directions so I’ll at least try to clarify the new rules as much as possible in this thread. I recognize this may be difficult to understand given the removal of durations, but the purpose of this change is to improve transparency and consistency, not worsen it.

  • As far as punishments go, most of them have remained the exact same. There are only minor adjustments with classification, expiration, and length for specific categories which were already changed internally. Expirations are NOT the length of punishment you’ll receive and an explanation for how this works is provided at the top of the page. The expiration system has been used by staff for years, this is not a new concept whatsoever, we’ve just made it public info for you guys.

  • The staff team has always followed a different staff guide. Over the span of multiple years the public and staff documents have been maintained separately. Naturally and to no one’s fault, issues will arise when two systems which are meant to function simultaneously have very different layouts and designs. A lot of the backlash staff have received over time has actually stemmed from this exact reason because the community’s understanding of our policies came solely from our rules page, whereas staff’s understanding came from a separate and more complicated system. This new layout, which is now extremely similar between both documents, allows us to refine things so that what you guys see is almost identical to what staff see. Having a complete understanding of our system will actually help with advocating against unfair punishments. The reason everyone feels overlooked is because staff and players functioned on entirely different structures, and sometimes what didn’t make sense to you guys made sense to staff. I understand that durations provided nice insight into staff routines but simply highlighting every punishment has not been an effective way to communicate our expectations to the community, nor provided enough examples about what each violation entails. From a moderation standpoint this also has not been ideal because players have abused it to break rules while bypassing major punishments.
    @Sprenkyy and @NuttyNutsman since you guys are pretty vocal I hope you don’t mind being mentioned but I'd like to explain; Sprenky, your report about staff misconduct is simply because the category wasn't thoroughly explained to the public, and Nutty, all of your conflicts are due to a lack of mutual understanding between staff and players. I promise, it has never had anything to do with staff prejudice.

  • In terms of staff consistency, every new staff member already undergoes a long and intensive training period where they are drilled about staff conduct, required to gather approval for punishments, and repeatedly tested about their knowledge. All aspects of the staff team are also monitored regularly by myself and other senior members, and we have several types of internal logs to help with this. Differing staff opinions haven’t actually been a problem as you’ll notice that staff tend to be on the same page. This isn’t because they’re actively working against the community, but because they have a collective understanding of the rules, and this is achieved by actually learning them and not by calculating punishment durations.

  • We don’t punish for trivial matters in private messages unless they’re reported. I’d like to clarify that the mute discussed on Discord was about inappropriate subjects which have no place in a community with children, and we regulate these topics tightly for everyone’s safety. Not quite sure if the mute mentioned in this thread is about the same situation though.

  • Finally, Sprenky explained that the current display for punishment types makes it seem like punishments go directly from minor punishments to permanent ones. I can see why it’d be interpreted that way and will be working on redesigning it, thank you for the genuine feedback. If anyone else has relevant feedback it’d be much appreciated, or if there are still unanswered questions about this feel free to ask.
Thank you for a lot of clarification and support so far.
The biggest issue I had regarding my /ah trouble was mainly that most staff said it was allowed and only a two so far had another view.
This implies that the issue isn’t that the category isn’t explained to the public but a lack of continuity in the staff team itself where the staff team can not provide the same answer as a whole but produce different answers depending on the individual.

And that is one of the issues I came across. Since you guys always tell us to ask staff if you aren’t sure how to interpret the rules.

But as long the staff can’t provide an continuous answer as a whole. I am afraid I will keep pressing on it
 
Thank you for a lot of clarification and support so far.
The biggest issue I had regarding my /ah trouble was mainly that most staff said it was allowed and only a two so far had another view.
This implies that the issue isn’t that the category isn’t explained to the public but a lack of continuity in the staff team itself where the staff team can not provide the same answer as a whole but produce different answers depending on the individual.

And that is one of the issues I came across. Since you guys always tell us to ask staff if you aren’t sure how to interpret the rules.

But as long the staff can’t provide an continuous answer as a whole. I am afraid I will keep pressing on it
Agreed. They ar just dismissin us